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Thread: So what do you folks think about the Dow Jones Index?

  1. #191
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    Quote Originally Posted by Newman View Post
    Get back under your bridge, Norm.
    That's an impressive display of derpitude.

    It is the nature of grotesque things that you can't look away
    -Pete Buttigieg

  2. #192
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    What do I think about the Dow? I would bet my last dollar that if Hillary were elected, we would already be in a recession.

    Thats what I think.

    Mark
    Race Card: A tool of the intellectually weak and lazy when they cannot counter a logical argument or factual data.

    "Liberals have to stop insisting that the world is what they want it to be instead of the way it is." - Bill Maher

    Political correctness is ideological fascism. Itís the antithesis of freedom. Dr. Piper

    Gender is not a "Social Construct", it is an outgrowth of biological reality.

  3. #193
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    Quote Originally Posted by Billy Jingo View Post
    The tariffs, leveled at various nations and products, have been absorbed (not paid) by different entities in reality but they are paid by the importer of record.

    And no, China ain't paying jack shit.
    Yeah.

    China ainít paying jack shit.
    OK. The part above is somewhat true, and Norm's statement you were riffing on is completely true:
    Tariffs are not collected from China. Tariffs are collected from importers and paid by their customers.
    Tariffs are merely a tax. China can "absorb" tariffs by subsidizing exports, as I mentioned.

    Importers "absorb" tariffs by taking a hit, which they'll do as much as they have to as they work off inventory. Which is one reason people say we won't "feel" the tariffs for a couple of weeks.

    "Working off inventory" is prelude to cutting orders.

    Consumers here may choose to "absorb" the tax, but it's not likely in this case, since the key to China's success, as in Walmart and Payless, is not quality but price. If Chinese goods cost the consumer as much or more than better quality goods from elsewhere, the Chinese are out of luck. (The consumer is "out of luck" for being forced to buy a higher priced product. That's the anti-protectionist argument.)

    China pays a steep price indeed.
    "We have to stop demonizing people and realize the biggest terror threat in this country is white men, most of them radicalized to the right, and we have to start doing something about them." óCNN's Don Lemon, showing how to stop demonizing people.

  4. #194
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    China ainít paying jack shit.
    Not paying, but losing money. Which is the same thing so...

    Mark
    Race Card: A tool of the intellectually weak and lazy when they cannot counter a logical argument or factual data.

    "Liberals have to stop insisting that the world is what they want it to be instead of the way it is." - Bill Maher

    Political correctness is ideological fascism. Itís the antithesis of freedom. Dr. Piper

    Gender is not a "Social Construct", it is an outgrowth of biological reality.

  5. #195
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    Here's an example of consumers not absorbing a new tax:

    Philadelphia soda sales plunge after taxing sugary drinks
    Sales of soda and other sweetened beverages plunged nearly 40% in Philadelphia after the city taxed the drinks in 2017, a new study found. Beverage sales within the city's limits dropped 51%, but an increase in sales just outside Philadelphia's borders resulted in a net drop of 38%, according to the findings published Tuesday in the Journal of the American Medical Association.
    Turns out consumers are fairly nimble. The Chinese are looking at the same sort of response.
    "We have to stop demonizing people and realize the biggest terror threat in this country is white men, most of them radicalized to the right, and we have to start doing something about them." óCNN's Don Lemon, showing how to stop demonizing people.

  6. #196
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    Quote Originally Posted by 80zephyr View Post
    Not paying, but losing money. Which is the same thing so...

    Mark
    No. Itís not. There are no accounts filling with yuans used to pay tariffs. There are only dollars paid by importers of record.

    Trump lies. You cannot make his lies reality. No matter how hard you try. You can only make them delusions.
    The reason Trump succeeded isnít that complicated after all. He didnít win the nomination by tapping into some nascent political movement. He won by doing a fairly good impression of a right-wing media celebrity. Every issue, every conspiracy, every applause line has been ripped from their websites, radio shows, and television programs. Itís why he became Americaís most prominent birther. Itís why he floated rumors that Ted Cruzís dad killed JFK, and that Hillary Clinton killed Vince Foster. Itís why he talks the way he does about Mexicans and Muslims and women and African Americans. Itís why heís been able to get away with knowing little to nothing about policy or government or world affairs ó because Trump, like any good talking head, only speaks in chyrons and clauses and some-people-are-sayings.

    Trumpís greatest trick has been to realize that right-wing media stars have a built-in audience that Republican politicians donít. To that audience, Jeb Bush talks like Washington talks. Ted Cruz talks like conservative ideologues talk. Marco Rubio talks like the last consultant he spoke with talks. But Trump talks like a true talk radio fan ó longtime listener, first-time caller. He comes off like the winner of a reality TV show in which one lucky Fox viewer gets picked to run for president of the United States.

  7. #197
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    Quote Originally Posted by 80zephyr View Post
    Not paying, but losing money. Which is the same thing so...

    Mark
    Norm and BJ are selective literalists. They reject metaphors like "paying the price" because the Chinese aren't literally writing a check for the tax.

    I don't know where they get this crap. Maybe CNN. I haven't watched in a while. The media spin of the day is Trump is hammering American consumers.



    Next thing you know the Democrats and their media wing will be citing the Koch brothers.
    "We have to stop demonizing people and realize the biggest terror threat in this country is white men, most of them radicalized to the right, and we have to start doing something about them." óCNN's Don Lemon, showing how to stop demonizing people.

  8. #198
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    Quote Originally Posted by Newman View Post
    Norm and BJ are selective literalists.
    It is interesting how much you, personally, and so many others, take on the tics, traits, and rhetorical patterns of Trump. In this case, like the President, you reveal yourself with your accusations. It truly is an inchoate cult in this nation. That is both terrible and fascinating at the same time.
    The reason Trump succeeded isnít that complicated after all. He didnít win the nomination by tapping into some nascent political movement. He won by doing a fairly good impression of a right-wing media celebrity. Every issue, every conspiracy, every applause line has been ripped from their websites, radio shows, and television programs. Itís why he became Americaís most prominent birther. Itís why he floated rumors that Ted Cruzís dad killed JFK, and that Hillary Clinton killed Vince Foster. Itís why he talks the way he does about Mexicans and Muslims and women and African Americans. Itís why heís been able to get away with knowing little to nothing about policy or government or world affairs ó because Trump, like any good talking head, only speaks in chyrons and clauses and some-people-are-sayings.

    Trumpís greatest trick has been to realize that right-wing media stars have a built-in audience that Republican politicians donít. To that audience, Jeb Bush talks like Washington talks. Ted Cruz talks like conservative ideologues talk. Marco Rubio talks like the last consultant he spoke with talks. But Trump talks like a true talk radio fan ó longtime listener, first-time caller. He comes off like the winner of a reality TV show in which one lucky Fox viewer gets picked to run for president of the United States.

  9. #199
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    Quote Originally Posted by Newman View Post
    Norm and BJ are selective literalists. They reject metaphors like "paying the price" because the Chinese aren't literally writing a check for the tax.

    I don't know where they get this crap. Maybe CNN. I haven't watched in a while. The media spin of the day is Trump is hammering American consumers.



    Next thing you know the Democrats and their media wing will be citing the Koch brothers.
    What was rejected was this direct quote from the article you posted:

    Retaliatory Chinese tariffs on U.S. agricultural goods are hurting farmers, badly. Trump has allocated $12 billion to ease the economic pain of lost sales and may soon proffer more, using tariff money collected from China.
    You probably missed that because it's a direct quote and not twisted and distorted. "[T]ariff money collected from China" is not a metaphor. It's a lie.

    It is the nature of grotesque things that you can't look away
    -Pete Buttigieg

  10. #200
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Jingo
    No. Itís not. There are no accounts filling with yuans used to pay tariffs. There are only dollars paid by importers of record.

    Trump lies. You cannot make his lies reality. No matter how hard you try. You can only make them delusions.
    Well, China is imposing retaliatory tariffs which will be, literally, accounts filled with their currency.

    But that's relatively trivial.

    If we are going to change our trade habits with the Chinese, and if it's going to take some hard head-butting, now is the time to do it.

    Thanks to His Holiness Barack, we have a very strong economy. We have a worker productivity about five times the Chinese. We have a GDP somewhere between 1Ĺ and twice theirs, with about a third the population. They have a billion people to keep busy over there.

    We're in the drivers seat. The Chinese are not in shape to endure much of this, much less prevail; their only shot is to keeping provoking the squalling toddlers in the back seat. Maybe we'll pull over and give up.

    I don't think so, though. His Holiness isn't president now, and the usual anti-tariff Republicans like Grassley are holding their fire.
    "We have to stop demonizing people and realize the biggest terror threat in this country is white men, most of them radicalized to the right, and we have to start doing something about them." óCNN's Don Lemon, showing how to stop demonizing people.

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