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Thread: Odessa gunman bought weapon through private sale: Sources

  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Newman View Post
    Well, one more thing.

    I'm confident I know less about guns and gun sales than phillygirl, so far, but I know Democrats a bit better.

    There is no "minimal" or "let's say" reasonable middle ground with them in their current incarnation. Limits only exist when they are stopped. This year's crop of presidential nominees are proving the point on every issue. How about a reasonable middle ground on abortion limitations? border crossings? climate concerns? medical expenses?

    Beto, bless his fucking little fuckitty-fuck heart, is merely pushing his toe a little bit further into the sunlight when he says he will confiscate scary guns.

    They can't help it, because that's where their heart is.

    Initially I was fairly sanguine about Red Flag laws. It seemed reasonable to me, even knowing that acrimonious divorce cases, a simple example, would complicate life unnecessarily for a lot of people.

    But here I see San Francisco Democrats just can't stop themselves:

    San Francisco Declares NRA a 'Domestic Terrorist Organization'

    Surely Red Flag laws would lower the boom on anyone who's a member of a terrorist organization, right?

    They will always show their hand if you let them, and when they do, believe them.
    I understand, but it's got to start somewhere. I agree with Adam's point that he'd like to have his father's gun(s) when his father passes. And I understand that Adam would be a fine recipient. But I don't necessarily see where that excuses the need to have Adam in some way prove that he's not a convicted felon. Much like the special FAA passes that allow frequent travelers to obtain special vetting ahead of time to be able to skip some of the security lanes, a potential buyer should be able to have a background check that is renewed yearly to buy however many guns they want from whomever they want because they've got the background check paperwork already in hand. Similarly, it shouldn't be that onerous to have a state and federal background check performed. If a seller is just selling the gun from their recently deceased father, then a $50 charge by the government should get them the background checks on 1 -3 purchasers per year. More than that and you're operating as an actual dealer and subject to whatever the costs are for a dealer who is making profits on the transactions.

    A kid under 18 (now 21) has to show i.d. to purchase cigarettes. The seller of the cigarettes has to be the one verifying the age. If I spot someone 1 or 2 cigarettes at the bus station, I'm not checking id's. If I'm selling them at Wawa, I am.
    Not where I breathe, but where I love, I live...
    Robert Southwell, S.J.

  2. #42
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    "Oh, man, we got burgled again. The burglar came in through that unlocked window."

    "Maybe we should lock that window."

    "Don't be ridiculous. It's illegal for the burglar to come through that unlocked window. Criminals don't respect laws. End of story."

    "But why don't we lock-"

    "What makes you think a burglar won't just break the window and come in anyway?"

    "We already lock the doors. Why not that window?"

    "I'm not interested in the moat you want to dig around the place."

    "I'm just saying we should lock the window."

    "It's a slippery slope. You're just advancing your agenda to hogtie the entire place with red tape because you want to make entry impossible so you're in total control."

    "Um, no. Again, just want to lock that-"

    "It's terrible that you want to politicize this tragedy. Never let a crisis go to waste, right?"

    "So are we gonna leave all the doors and windows unlocked from now on?"

    "Well, there's no point talking to you if you're going to be unreasonable."

    On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart’s desire at last, and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.
    -H. L. Mencken

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by phillygirl View Post
    I understand, but it's got to start somewhere. I agree with Adam's point that he'd like to have his father's gun(s) when his father passes. And I understand that Adam would be a fine recipient. But I don't necessarily see where that excuses the need to have Adam in some way prove that he's not a convicted felon.
    Might as well say the same thing about cars. Or scarves. Or screwdrivers.
    Maybe all Americans need to have permits and background checks for their hands.

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  5. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lady Marva View Post
    Might as well say the same thing about cars. Or scarves. Or screwdrivers.
    Maybe all Americans need to have permits and background checks for their hands.
    Cars require a licensed and insured owner, along with proof of same. I'm not sure that scarves and screwdrivers have been shown to be a large cause of death and dismemberment.
    Not where I breathe, but where I love, I live...
    Robert Southwell, S.J.

  6. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Norm dePlume View Post
    Have you never passed a background check? I have. Didn't hurt a bit.
    Already explained. Now you're just being disingenuous, and like your shadow, make discussion with you pointless.
    Leftists have unquestionably demonstrated their hatred for due process, and Democrats have undeniably obstructed justice for, and thoroughly victim-shamed and smeared, Karen Monahan.

  7. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Norm dePlume View Post
    "Oh, man, we got burgled again. The burglar came in through that unlocked window."

    "Maybe we should lock that window."

    "Don't be ridiculous. It's illegal for the burglar to come through that unlocked window. Criminals don't respect laws. End of story."

    "But why don't we lock-"

    "What makes you think a burglar won't just break the window and come in anyway?"

    "We already lock the doors. Why not that window?"

    "I'm not interested in the moat you want to dig around the place."

    "I'm just saying we should lock the window."

    "It's a slippery slope. You're just advancing your agenda to hogtie the entire place with red tape because you want to make entry impossible so you're in total control."

    "Um, no. Again, just want to lock that-"

    "It's terrible that you want to politicize this tragedy. Never let a crisis go to waste, right?"

    "So are we gonna leave all the doors and windows unlocked from now on?"

    "Well, there's no point talking to you if you're going to be unreasonable."
    My mother refused to secure the sliding glass door when we went away. Her reasoning was that if a burglar really wanted to get in, he would, and then she'd be faced with the cost of replacing that as well. She was probably right.
    Not where I breathe, but where I love, I live...
    Robert Southwell, S.J.

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  9. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Newman View Post
    Question. I recently read that an Illinois politician blamed Chicago gun violence on guns coming in from out of state, from Indiana in particular. She was responding to the commonly noted irony of Chicago gun violence in the face of exceptionally restrictive laws, and seemed to be appealing for more federal restrictions, as well as tagging a scapegoat.

    But that would seem to run against your account of interstate sale requirements.

    What's going on?

    edit to add: This is what I saw, but it appears that blaming surrounding states for Chicago's problems goes back quite a ways.

    Chicago mayor clashes with Cruz over gun violence: ‘Keep our name out of your mouth’
    What's going on is straw purchases and stolen guns.

    Some gang-banger manages to get someone in Indiana to buy guns and then resell them out of the trunk of a Pontiac in some back alley on the southside. Or, the gang-banger busts into a gun shop in Gary after hours and makes off with 20 pistols. In both cases, trying to control this at the source is well-neigh impossible, since you can't practically stop every car going north on I 65.
    Leftists have unquestionably demonstrated their hatred for due process, and Democrats have undeniably obstructed justice for, and thoroughly victim-shamed and smeared, Karen Monahan.

  10. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam View Post
    Already explained. Now you're just being disingenuous, and like your shadow, make discussion with you pointless.
    No. What is pointless is pretending you are being rational when you say there shouldn't be laws because criminals will just break them.
    “Totalitarianism in power invariably replaces all first-rate talents, regardless of their sympathies, with those crackpots and fools whose lack of intelligence and creativity is still the best guarantee of their loyalty.”

    ~ Hannah Arendt

  11. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Billy Jingo View Post
    No. What is pointless is pretending you are being rational when you say there shouldn't be laws because criminals will just break them.
    Liar.
    Leftists have unquestionably demonstrated their hatred for due process, and Democrats have undeniably obstructed justice for, and thoroughly victim-shamed and smeared, Karen Monahan.

  12. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam View Post
    Already explained. Now you're just being disingenuous, and like your shadow, make discussion with you pointless.
    Heh.

    Quote Originally Posted by Norm dePlume View Post
    "Well, there's no point talking to you if you're going to be unreasonable."
    Yeah, I'm disingenuous because I didn't take seriously the $10,000 background check fee you dreamed up.

    Quote Originally Posted by Adam View Post
    Two, it's an avenue for those who want to find a way to strip the law-abiding of their rights ("Oh, you want to buy a gun from a private seller? No problem! Just fill out this background check form and pay the modest $10,000 federally-mandated background check fee and we'll get started right away.").

    On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart’s desire at last, and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.
    -H. L. Mencken

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